CoH: Modern Combat

First of all, I appreciate what the developers have done with creating, testing and bugfixing. I don't know how much effort all that takes but I DO know that it is alot.


Hi everybody, ya'll probably know about me now. I'm one of the two dudes who have posted alot of replays. Not that I know what anybody ever thought about them....


Got a wall of complaints.

Played against FastCastle (ManBearPig) last night as PLA and decided that enough is enough. I can't stand this static faction with weak and static (nonversatile) units that got such a hard time fighting the US with their strong AND versatile units....but then again it's the same in vCoH....one faction is versatile and the other is not (and therefore loses).
One faction fuckin ROLLS the other with Rifles alone and the other faction has to do quite a bit to prevent that from happening.

Then there is the mines. THE.GOD.DAMN.MINES!

Antipersonell mines for 20muni is nice but no antiarmor mine is bullshit! Having to go The Future is Now to get them shouldn't be needed. Meanwhile, the US got the vCoH mine which is useful against EVERYTHING (ofcourse....who's surprised??) for 25muni. Now I support asymmetric factions but PLA CAN'T afford to lack in mines! Their other AT is not good enough. RPG troops work until a riflesquad with a grenadelauncher or two Riflesquads show up. ATgun is nice but just like in CoH 2 with soviets you can't afford to build all four buildings with PLA. It costs too god damn much! So if you want good infantry and support you have to get tier 2. After that you have to go tier 4 to get some fucking stayingpower on the field that don't IMMEDIETLY gets destroyed + decent artillery. If you instead go tier 3 you get a vehicle, a halftrack and an ATgun.

You could power up the AT gun with a global or individual upgrade or make the player choose one of three modes with a 20 second cooldowntime or shutdowntime. Increased range, speed, sightrange or damage.
Another idea is to have tier 3 as the support tier and tier 4 as the assault tier. Adding a buildable Howitzer if you have tier 3 would be nice.

Then we got the doctrines....

I don't know WHO got the absolutely BRILLIANT idea to nerf boobytraps into the fuckin GROUND but it's good, one less doctrine to consider.
The other two are decent but not as good as the US ones. What wouldn't I give for a StuH 42....


The Eastern Front is just completely superior in the doctrine department. When I read about the Ostheer doctrines, they sounded great. Checked out the Army Support tree (left) and liked what I saw. Tried the Elite tree (middle) and was even more impressed. Lastly I tried the Army Fortress tree (right) and was blown away. Those doctrines are the best I've EVER seen in a Company of Heroes game. So good and useful abilities in so thematic and good doctrines!



By now you understand that I think Modern Combat is not as good as The Eastern Front and will therefore go over to that.
MC is too static with too few options. Two whole tiers with infantry that Rifles alone can stand against AND a third tier they can destroy with AT4s....
Cost of first buildings are ignored.

Getting an early PLA Puma takes 200(!) fuel and is NOT worth the effort since Rifles can use an AT4 to scare it away, use two At4s to cripple it (or destroy?) or get a Javelin which they should have by that point.
In comparison, in vCoH it costs 130 fuel to get an M8 which means it gets out a lot earlier and can withstand more damage due to its armored skirts upgrade. In Modern Combat, it's the Strykers that get armored skirts....


The competiive community is lacking as well. I got two guys I can play with on my lvl (one of'em I've played ONCE!) and the most frequent posters here are only talking about realism.... That's not the community I envisioned....

I will check out the MODDB site now and then and discuss my topic here a bit but other than that, I'm gone from this place until a significant update convinces me to return.
You'll find me on Steam and The Eastern Front forums.

/Jerry

/Jerry[/quote]

hello Campaigner..!!

I really know your frustration about PLA system...first of all, you need consider that you can not compair 2 totally different game like MC and EF are.....

EF just create a single fraction (Russian) and lots of those abilities, weapons, vehicles, skins and sounds were made and created before....

the vanilla COH damge system use the counterpart on any unit or vehicle (similar vehicles and soldiers) and the real damage system is not the real capacity of every weapon.. for example:

the 88mm (tiger) cannon has the same power like the 90mm (M26 pershing) cannon in the vanilla COH...

this is made for balance...

when the people talk about realism they are talking about modify MC hardcore mode not the regular mod (online game)

second: EF just take the same balance that COH 2 has...
they have lot of his work made.... for otherwise the MC developers need make every ability, soldiers, upgrades, weapons, vehicles and effect by themself....(hard work)

everybody know the PLA need more power in this moment and they are working on these changes but you need wait....

In this moment the MC Developers are recieving suggestions and advice from Chinese people ( from the community)... because we do not know nothing about the tactics, weapon, vehicles and movility of PLA...

they are creating all vehicles and abilities of PLA fraction totally blind...(imagination)

The PLA fraction was not finish to create yet... will come new changes for PLA fraction.

but you need wait, you can help them to know how the PLA works...

do not be mad with them, they are simple humans and this game is not easy to balance... every change you can make, will affect the other fraction...

I suggested long time ago add all soldiers unit in the Infantry HQ and to the same with other buildings...light armored vehicles on other building (ACP, IFV, AT..etc), medium and heavy armored vehicle in onther building and the 4º building is for upgrades... to leave free space for vehicles in the other buildings

and obviously lock all vehicles units that should be unlocked using the command tree point earned...

on this way you force the gamers use the infantry to gain points to unlock new units in the command tree on this way you can avoid the vehicles avalanche...

the objetive on this game should be: gain or obtain command tree points to unlock the units... with this kind of game, only the tactics decide the battle and not how much vehicles you can build...

I am totally agree with you about the PLA regular soldiers should have RPG like the US has AT4...

other thing that would be great should be give from AT team PLA the camo ability to ambush vehicles...

totally agree about mines and explosive charges, they should be in every doctrine and the cost should be lower because you need time to put them in the field and your soldiers will be exposed...

Other thing is the PLA need more recon abilities (recon airplanes, satellites)

what do you think?
Do you think that one of these option can make the game more balanced?

tell me what do you want? your opinion is important..

Campaigner wrote:The competiive community is lacking as well. I got two guys I can play with on my lvl (one of'em I've played ONCE!) and the most frequent posters here are only talking about realism.... That's not the community I envisioned....

In fact, realism and balance are interdependent. Real PLA and US Army regard each other as imaginary enemy, and optimize their equipments, formations and tactics in order to defeat each other. If you look into real PLA formation, you'll see it would be very balanced if the whole formation is bulid as a faction in game. The problem of PLA in the mod is that it's a incomplete system, both of realism and balancing.
I tried to modify the PLA faction in order to make it fit real PLA formation, and tried the modified version with my friends - it's a little more balanced, but I think there's still more units of specific role are needed to make the whole system complete.

I tried to modify the PLA faction in order to make it fit real PLA formation, and tried the modified version with my friends - it's a little more balanced, but I think there's still more units of specific role are needed to make the whole system complete.[/quote]

I am totally agree with you about the PLA is incomplete...for example the PLA need a mortar carrier vehicle and ATGM vehicle... they are essential in the battlefield.

I really hope you and your partners can make something great with the PLA...

I just added every vehicle in his respective factories to be buildable, give slit-trench for both factions, smoke cloud, special munition and abilities for all vehicles...

I think all PLA infantry should have RPG fire ability and the Anti tank team should have PF98 but I do not know how make these changes...

would be great if you can help to create a better PLA faction...

AAMC4 wrote:I am totally agree with you about the PLA is incomplete...for example the PLA need a mortar carrier vehicle and ATGM vehicle... they are essential in the battlefield.

I really hope you and your partners can make something great with the PLA...

I just added every vehicle in his respective factories to be buildable, give slit-trench for both factions, smoke cloud, special munition and abilities for all vehicles...

I think all PLA infantry should have RPG fire ability and the Anti tank team should have PF98 but I do not know how make these changes...

would be great if you can help to create a better PLA faction...

For Nothern Motorized Divisions:
In artillery regiments, there's a AT battalion with PTL-02 (WZ551 chassis with 100mm smoothbore gun) and HJ-8 carrier (HJ-8 Launcher on Beijing 212 jeep)
And, every PLA division has at least 2 howitzer battalions (152mm, 130mm or 122mm) and 1 MLRS battalion (122mm), some of them even got more.

I totally agree!
Sometimes it seems that there are the cool US-Factions with spec ops and everything (The factions ARE very cool indeed) and the chinese army on the other side, just to have somobody to fight against.
Though I see that the Pla seems to focus more on the combination of specialized units, why not really give at least the Pla infantry an anti tank ability. I think you would still need the RPG-Troops as the US needs Javelins too even though their riflemen have an anti tank ability.
Also, why not make PlA units look a bit cooler, maybe by giving them scarfs or goggles too? (Though they DO already look a lot cooler with the new camouflage!)
I see that there are many many posts like "Why don't you add this cool US unit or this cool Hightech US vehicle to the game?" and of course you have to please the community but I'm sure playing the US would be a lot more fun if the PLA would be a bit more badass.

Sill F*********************ING AMAZING MOD guys!

Unreal-Eugen wrote:I totally agree!
Sometimes it seems that there are the cool US-Factions with spec ops and everything (The factions ARE very cool indeed) and the chinese army on the other side, just to have somobody to fight against.
Though I see that the Pla seems to focus more on the combination of specialized units, why not really give at least the Pla infantry an anti tank ability. I think you would still need the RPG-Troops as the US needs Javelins too even though their riflemen have an anti tank ability.
Also, why not make PlA units look a bit cooler, maybe by giving them scarfs or goggles too? (Though they DO already look a lot cooler with the new camouflage!)
I see that there are many many posts like "Why don't you add this cool US unit or this cool Hightech US vehicle to the game?" and of course you have to please the community but I'm sure playing the US would be a lot more fun if the PLA would be a bit more badass.

Sill F*********************ING AMAZING MOD guys!

Most of my friends say so...PLA faction in game feels neither balanced nor realistic.

AAMC4,

I don't believe anyone want a version where there is only faction (I know I don't). Only unlocking vehicles and tanks would make it boring, negate fuel I believe and what about all abilities you can unlock with commandpoints?
I do want buildable vehicles.

Mines CANNOT become cheaper! It would ruin the game! Mines win games (in vCoH atleast). All I want is the PLA to have the ability to build antivehicle mines (Teller mines?) without a doctrine.


I know that the developers have done alot of work since they have to make everything. But the gamer doesn't really care about that since to him, it is the results that matter.
If one gamecompany works for 10 years and the game is a mess (Duke Nukem Forever) and another works for 2 years and make a blockbuster (latest Battlefield or Call of Duty) people just think the former are stupid and will buy the latter.


I don't understand what you mean with the Tiger (88mm) and the Pershing (90mm).


Unreal-Eugen,

I thought that somebody agreed with me Many there are who wants this or that cool US unit. Very few know how to implement it in a good way though.

Campaigner wrote:AAMC4,

I don't believe anyone want a version where there is only faction (I know I don't). Only unlocking vehicles and tanks would make it boring, negate fuel I believe and what about all abilities you can unlock with commandpoints?
I do want buildable vehicles.

Mines CANNOT become cheaper! It would ruin the game! Mines win games (in vCoH atleast). All I want is the PLA to have the ability to build antivehicle mines (Teller mines?) without a doctrine.


I know that the developers have done alot of work since they have to make everything. But the gamer doesn't really care about that since to him, it is the results that matter.
If one gamecompany works for 10 years and the game is a mess (Duke Nukem Forever) and another works for 2 years and make a blockbuster (latest Battlefield or Call of Duty) people just think the former are stupid and will buy the latter.


I don't understand what you mean with the Tiger (88mm) and the Pershing (90mm).


Unreal-Eugen,

I thought that somebody agreed with me Many there are who wants this or that cool US unit. Very few know how to implement it in a good way though.

who is talking about delete the "abilities" from the commnad tree? I am talking about add the vehicles in the command tree to be unlockable... to avoid the brutal avalanche of US armored vehicles...

You are crying because US get vehicles in the T2 when PLA need T3...

the mine are good options to stop vehicles, that is the reason because mines exist....to stop the enemy advance ..so?

companies like "Activision" have hundreds of people that work for them, this guys got a salary every month... without mention that you need buy their game to play it...

For otherwise, these guys make this game without any pay for that and let you play for nothing... think about it..!

if you have any suggestion to make PLA a better fraction you only need write... or colaborate with them if you can do it... that is it..

In my personal oppinion MC is a better game than EF...

I like MC better because is the only RTS talking about a relatively realistic "modern combat" that includes PLA.
BTW, @Campigner and @AAMC4 , I suggest you guys go to wish list and check out my version of PLA faction rebalancing plan. I and my friends are now talking about overworking and rebalancing of PLA faction, but we don't have anyone who is actually good at PVP or familir to those tactics...