CoH: Modern Combat

Well, after yet another very frustrating game, I'm done until the Abrams is fixed. The amount that it costs and what it takes to get it into the game isn't returned once it's on the field.

So how strong are you supposing the Abrams is, or it should be>

South wrote:So how strong are you supposing the Abrams is, or it should be>

I've posted about that a few times. I think the Abrams was fine where it was in 1.015, and if anything needed adjusted it was the PLA and their AT. They adjusted both, and I don't think it works. I've tried to like it, but I just don't even bother with the Abrams anymore. I certainly don't think it should be where it's at now. For what it takes to get one into the game, it needs to be powerful and should be the focus of the game. As it sits now, it's just another easy target for ALL of the PLA AT.

I'm not the expert, and this is all against the AI. I'm just giving my opinions on it.

SnowBlaZeR2 wrote:

South wrote:So how strong are you supposing the Abrams is, or it should be>

I've posted about that a few times. I think the Abrams was fine where it was in 1.015, and if anything needed adjusted it was the PLA and their AT. They adjusted both, and I don't think it works. I've tried to like it, but I just don't even bother with the Abrams anymore. I certainly don't think it should be where it's at now. For what it takes to get one into the game, it needs to be powerful and should be the focus of the game. As it sits now, it's just another easy target for ALL of the PLA AT.

I'm not the expert, and this is all against the AI. I'm just giving my opinions on it.

In my opinion, Abrams is NOT Baneblade or King Tiger, and it's reasonable for Abrams to be destroyed by ambushed AT gun or other anti-tank methods of PLA - don't forget, you are fighting an regular army of a superpower - not militia and terrorist - and their anti-tank methods are dedicate to Sovier Union and his steel monsters.

I've seen the Abrams in action, and there's nothing China has that would scare it. It's not only the armor it has. The technology and armament are far superior. We wouldn't spend what we do on them if one towed AT gun or a squad with RPGs could kill them.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm ok with sacrificing some of that for the sake of balance. I don't see anything balanced about it though. The cost, time and resources it takes to get the one tank out there isn't returned in capability.

SnowBlaZeR2 wrote:I've seen the Abrams in action, and there's nothing China has that would scare it. It's not only the armor it has. The technology and armament are far superior. We wouldn't spend what we do on them if one towed AT gun or a squad with RPGs could kill them.

I know you are a veteran, but you can't make the conclusion of "there's nothing China has that would scare it" before you have seen PLA forces. Abrams is NOT Baneblade.
Superior armor wouldn't defend even superior munitions, and hi-tech opto-electro equipments is also NOT invulnerable. After all, PLA is not Taliban or Iraqi.
I suggest you seeing this: http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/bts6ELfrvws/

South wrote:I know you are a veteran, but you can't make the conclusion of "there's nothing China has that would scare it" before you have seen PLA forces. Abrams is NOT Baneblade.
Superior armor wouldn't defend even superior munitions, and hi-tech opto-electro equipments is also NOT invulnerable. After all, PLA is not Taliban or Iraqi.
I suggest you seeing this: http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/bts6ELfrvws/

The Abrams wasn't designed to fight cowards and IEDs. It was designed to destroy any and all enemy armor that it may encounter, and it excels at that. I've seen the Abrams against heavy armor in the 2003 invasion, and I stand by what I originally said. None of that really matters, because we're talking about a game, and I'd rather just stick to that aspect of it. In the game, the Abrams costs more than it's currently worth, at least for the Marines.

SnowBlaZeR2 wrote:

South wrote:I know you are a veteran, but you can't make the conclusion of "there's nothing China has that would scare it" before you have seen PLA forces. Abrams is NOT Baneblade.
Superior armor wouldn't defend even superior munitions, and hi-tech opto-electro equipments is also NOT invulnerable. After all, PLA is not Taliban or Iraqi.
I suggest you seeing this: http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/bts6ELfrvws/

The Abrams wasn't designed to fight cowards and IEDs. It was designed to destroy any and all enemy armor that it may encounter, and it excels at that. I've seen the Abrams against heavy armor in the 2003 invasion, and I stand by what I originally said. None of that really matters, because we're talking about a game, and I'd rather just stick to that aspect of it. In the game, the Abrams costs more than it's currently worth, at least for the Marines.

What kind of heavy armor? Monkey-version of T72B? ZTZ-96 could take it down too (In fact it really did in Sudan).

Let's get back to balance issues. In my opinion, M1A2 is fuel-free while US factions are always lacking of fuel, because everything else needs fuel. In this sense, a much weaker T59D is even more expensive.

One more thing to remind you, PLA is not cowards, saying this will offend Chinese players in the forum.

He was referring to Middle Eastern soldiers as cowards. I disagree; say what you want about their ideologies and politics, but taking on planes, drones and gunships armed only with Kalashnikovs and RPGs requires massive balls. The Afghanis for example have fought against the British Empire, the Soviet Union and the USA. Most nations wouldn't have lasted a month against any of those superpowers.



OT: The M1A2 and M1A2 TUSK seem fine to me, although the M1A1 does seem to go down a bit too easily.

They all currently have the same main gun stats, however the M1A1 has 800 HP, the M1A2 has 900 HP and the TUSK has 950 HP. Might be worth increasing M1A1 HP and cost to to 850?

I want to say, this is a game forum, not a real war. We can discuss the balance problems. Yes, the M1 Abrams is a very great tank. But the PLA is also very great. Don't ignore the ZTZ-99 although ZTZ-99 didn't experience any wars. If the ZTZ-99 met M1A2 in the battleground, nobody know who would win. Maybe the M1A2 would become blind because of the laser suppress system, or the M1A2 was destroyed by the gunshot missile of ZTZ-99. Maybe the M1A2 destroyed the ZTZ-99, or the shell of ZTZ-99 ricocheted. China isn't Iraq or Yugoslavia. Do NOT despise China and CPLA.